MILAVIA Forum

Military Aviation => Air Power => Topic started by: Cobra2 on September 10, 2006, 07:14:05 PM

Title: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Cobra2 on September 10, 2006, 07:14:05 PM
Pick the two planes that you think would make the longest dogfight and put up a good fight.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Cobra2 on September 10, 2006, 07:16:45 PM
I picked the F-16 and EF-2000 Typhoon. There both great planes. I think they would make a good dogfight.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Webmaster on September 10, 2006, 07:55:33 PM
Typhoon against the F-22... let's see if the F-22 can manage in the WVR arena against the latest agile Euro delta.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: alyster on September 10, 2006, 08:14:18 PM
A-10 and Su-37 close range  8)
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Webmaster on September 10, 2006, 09:00:03 PM
A-10 and Su-37 close range  8)

Or any helicopter and a fighter at close range.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Viggen on September 11, 2006, 01:43:00 PM
I would love to to see Gripen and the F16 battle it out.   ;D
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on September 19, 2006, 10:38:12 AM
F-22 and F-15E. Interesting to see two of the most reputed fighter-bombers fight it out.

P.S. The '18 isn't great by me... ;)
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Valiant1 on October 04, 2006, 04:06:02 AM
I think the most interesting dogfight would be between an F-15C Eagle and an Su-27 Flanker - no holds barred...all out...without political interference...the Cope India excercise flown by both American F-15C's and Indian Su-30MK's (I think that was the variant)  didn't tell the real truth. 

Put them up against each other again...equal pilot skills...equal armament and go at it! 
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on October 13, 2006, 10:08:14 AM
i think a Eurofighter and a Gripen would make a good fight. They are both agile and have good combat systems. The Sweedes train their pilots well, and so do most of the Euro countries.

now that i think about it, a Eurofighter, Rafale and Gripen would make a great fight
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on October 13, 2006, 12:16:19 PM
3 way. Hey, i didn't think of that.

Then It'll be... B-1 against Tu-160. Ramming only.  ;D just kidding.
How about chopper air to air fights, then? Maybe a fight between the Eurocopter Tigre/Tiger, The AH-64 Apache (no longbow), and the Kamov Ka-52. This will be fun, no doubt about it  >:D
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on October 13, 2006, 12:47:44 PM
3 way. Hey, i didn't think of that.

Then It'll be... B-1 against Tu-160. Ramming only.  ;D just kidding.
How about chopper air to air fights, then? Maybe a fight between the Eurocopter Tigre/Tiger, The AH-64 Apache (no longbow), and the Kamov Ka-52. This will be fun, no doubt about it  >:D

make it a fatal-four-way and add the South African Attack Chopper (whats it called??)

and you could even have a MI-24 versus Huey versus BlackHawk...
Personally i think the Hind would win because ive heard it carriers Russian Side Winders!!
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on October 13, 2006, 12:50:51 PM
I'll stay on the ground with the patriot missile defence system while you guys are wasting fuel way up there.  ;D

Russian choppers are real great, but their fighters are... dubious...  ;)
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on October 13, 2006, 12:56:34 PM
I'll stay on the ground with the patriot missile defence system while you guys are wasting fuel way up there.  ;D

Russian choppers are real great, but their fighters are... dubious...  ;)

i'd do it the old fashioned way, give me a Vulcan cannon anyday!!
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Viggen on October 13, 2006, 03:10:56 PM
Vulan and patriots, for kids. Give me the Barett 50 cal anti armour rifle and i would surprise the pilot with a headshot.  ;)
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on October 13, 2006, 04:53:46 PM
That's a kid's toy. i'd use a jack-knife. That'd make the rest look lively.

Hm, now that i think of it, i'd like to see a Sopwith camel with an M1A2 fight it out with an F-16 with Vickkers. ;D
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Viggen on October 13, 2006, 05:18:21 PM
That's a kid's toy. i'd use a jack-knife. That'd make the rest look lively.

Hm, now that i think of it, i'd like to see a Sopwith camel with an M1A2 fight it out with an F-16 with Vickkers. ;D

Ha Ha Ha!!!!  lmao :D
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on October 14, 2006, 02:31:09 AM
how about a long a boring fight?

Get a Fokker Triplane (like the Red Barons- who mightve been killed by an Aussie :o) and an F-16 or a F-22 and shoot down the -16 or -22 with a .303 bolt action rifle...how boring

well, if you think about it would be the earliest form of dogfights (before they got the idea to stick a machine gun on the wing) and the newest form of it...bvr, heat seeking...
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on October 14, 2006, 05:01:34 AM
for a challenge, try a Milan Anti-Tank Missile ;D
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on October 14, 2006, 09:58:26 AM
No, let's arm two F-16 with Fireworks. Then we can get them to dogfight.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on October 14, 2006, 10:08:55 AM
how would you declare a winner though?
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on October 14, 2006, 10:15:10 AM
Well, we could always have a tank of extremely volatile explosives mounted under the fuselage. of we could put some hydrogen ballons on TOP of the fuselage... Oh, boy. This i can't wait to see.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on October 14, 2006, 12:08:20 PM
or you wait and see which one gets bored with the idea first.

Maybe all future dogfights could be settled with a game of chicken

build a big brick wall, get to planes and make them fly at it. the first one to eject or pull away looses!
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on October 14, 2006, 12:10:46 PM
It's gotta be a big brick wall. Ok, you fly the SR-71 and i'll fly the AH-47. Doesn't work, see?
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on October 14, 2006, 12:26:48 PM
obviously theyd have to be flying the same plane
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on October 14, 2006, 12:29:06 PM
Ah. Then both can fly SR-71s
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on October 14, 2006, 12:31:01 PM
i thought there was only 2 SR-71's left, and they are both in a museum?
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on October 14, 2006, 12:33:00 PM
We could fish them out and use them... or maybe we could both fly C-17 Globemaster IIs.  ;D ;D ;D

Then we rip open the brick wall and keep on flying. or 2 F-22s. this isn't gonna work.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on October 14, 2006, 12:35:23 PM
what about MiGs?

theres millions of them
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on October 14, 2006, 12:42:36 PM
Sukhois are more popular. Oh, then i'd rather put some fellows who didn't train either...So if they die we don't waste money...

Aw, just stick to air racing. it's more sensible. And it's possible to other battles too, we get the plane to dogfight the missile. I'd like to see the Su-37 dogfighting the AIM-135. :)
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Cobra2 on October 15, 2006, 07:38:58 PM
You guys arent aces!  :D give me my good ol' 45 caliber colt and ill fight anyone  ;D
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on November 02, 2006, 07:46:30 AM
Ok. I'll save some cost and let you use the colt.

or how about an M1 Grant rifle. From WWII. I'll take the other M1. The M1 Abrams. Anyway. I'm certainly not an ace. I'm not even military flight lisenced.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Cobra2 on November 04, 2006, 03:07:20 AM
Haha, I'm not an ace iether..or a pilot...I was just joking. And, its the M-1 Garand, not Grant  :)
Title: Dogfight
Post by: Globetrotter on November 15, 2006, 05:34:31 PM
Personally, I'd like to see a dogfight between Mirage3 and F-104 >:D crazy, don't you think?? Both are, from my POV, not very manueverable, but nice machines and, well, it just would be nice to see.
Cheers!
Thomas
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Webmaster on December 06, 2006, 02:00:09 PM
Let's get back on topic.

I split the CoD discussion from this topic and created a topic for it under the Games category.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on December 07, 2006, 10:09:14 AM
Aww, now I have to go to that one aswel??

Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Globetrotter on December 07, 2006, 12:35:38 PM
What about Viggen vs. Gripen :o

I think the Viggen would have much more support (from people) :P

This dogfight seems good for me, as it has something personal ;D
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Viggen on December 08, 2006, 05:09:56 AM
What about Viggen vs. Gripen :o

I think the Viggen would have much more support (from people) :P

This dogfight seems good for me, as it has something personal ;D

Yes, Viggen would get more support. But Gripen would win that fight. Viggen is a defensive fighter from the coldwar-era. Its main job would of been shooting down bombers, not too take on other fighters. Yes it can outpreform the Gripen on certain things, and if the pilot is really good and have flown Viggen for many years it might do the impossible. :)
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on December 14, 2006, 11:50:44 AM
No, Viggen would ban Gripen and Gripen would be stuck out of this website. Unforunately. Aircraft-wise, the Viggen doesn't stand a chance.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on December 15, 2006, 02:27:38 AM
OMG, to save and damage to the Gripen, i would have to use somesort of AA missile, or just incapacitate the pilot on the ground or something. Or get the SAS to do the raid they did on an Argentine airbase and take everything out, like the did in the Falklands war.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on December 15, 2006, 03:45:15 AM
Nah. I'd use Isreali tactics. Sit on top with an E-2C and kill all the fighters as they take off. Bye-bye pilot AND fighter jet.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Viggen on December 15, 2006, 06:10:22 AM
No, Viggen would ban Gripen and Gripen would be stuck out of this website.

LOL  ;D ;D ;D

Another interesting dogfight would be between Rafal and the Eurofighter. Any suggestions? I would bet my money on the french.  :)
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on December 15, 2006, 07:05:31 AM
pfft, depends whos flying the Euro fighter

I hate the air dam things on them. they look stupid with them on it.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Viggen on December 15, 2006, 03:20:51 PM
Yes, they look stupid. But this is not a beauty-contest.  ;)
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Webmaster on December 15, 2006, 06:11:07 PM
What do you mean with "air dam things"? The engine inlets? You kinda need them with jet engines  :P

I think it will be pretty boring between Rafale and Typhoon (let's say UK is flying, ok, so ASRAAM yes), might as well watch two Eurofighters...or two Rafales? But tactics-wise might be quite interesting, if at least the RAF and AdlA tactics for flying their new planes differ.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on December 16, 2006, 02:45:10 AM
Well what ever they are, they look like they were added after they built the plane, like they just bolted it on as an after thought

"""We finished making the first Typhoon"""
"""Very good, show me""""
""""nice, but how do the engines breath"""""
"""""simple, by, by, ...."""""
"""""Just stick two of the biggest ugliest airdams you can find and put them on"""""

OMG, you think they do something to it to make it look less ugly.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Cobra2 on December 16, 2006, 08:02:06 PM
IMO I dont think they look to bad...but thats just my 2 cents...the EF-2000 Typhoon looks so mean!!
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Globetrotter on December 16, 2006, 08:28:05 PM
Quote
But this is not a beauty-contest.


"If the airplane is beautiful, then it must fly well."

Although I agree, it's not me who said it, but Marcel Bloch, better known as Dassault ;) I think he was right...
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on December 17, 2006, 04:24:25 AM
OK, ive just noticed. who spelt gripen with 2 p's?
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on January 31, 2007, 08:20:56 AM
OK, ive just noticed. who spelt gripen with 2 p's?

HAHA. That is hilarious.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Flanker.94 on April 15, 2007, 03:04:47 AM
I think it would be good to see a Su-37 fighting against an Eurofighter. They are on of the most maneuvrable aircrafts in the world.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Valiant1 on April 15, 2007, 09:08:51 PM
Mr. Flanker 94, the Su-37 would be out-turned, outmaneuvered and outclassed by the Typhoon. 
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Cobra2 on April 15, 2007, 11:19:21 PM
I agree. The Su-37 would stand no chance against the Typhoon.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on April 16, 2007, 05:04:33 AM
and your forgetting the fact that there are no Terminators flying, so like Typhoon wins by default..
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on April 18, 2007, 01:51:01 PM
Not really... The Terminator has a pretty good fighter potential. Flown by the same pilot, neither plane would have a much of an advantage. They're about exactly the same in most terms... Except that the Typhoon has a slight advantage... Which brings us back to square one. ;D

"If the airplane is beautiful, then it must fly well."

Hey, watch that. There are plenty of designs to contradict you there...
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Globetrotter on April 18, 2007, 06:34:42 PM
Not really... The Terminator has a pretty good fighter potential. Flown by the same pilot, neither plane would have a much of an advantage. They're about exactly the same in most terms... Except that the Typhoon has a slight advantage... Which brings us back to square one. ;D

Hey, watch that. There are plenty of designs to contradict you there...

It is not me who said that, pay atention, it was Marcel Bloch, better know by his pseudonim, Marcel Dassault ;)
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on April 19, 2007, 10:51:23 AM
Im guessing he has something to do with Dassault Berguet?
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Globetrotter on April 19, 2007, 06:34:57 PM
yes, he is the Dassault in the name ;) the other one is Breguet...another person
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on April 23, 2007, 12:06:40 PM
It is not me who said that, pay atention, it was Marcel Bloch, better know by his pseudonim, Marcel Dassault ;)

Your angliz iz horrigle. Spelling miztakez evewyware. Attenzion is zpeld wit doo t's.

Ok, then he's the freakiest person ever. The Mirage looks beautiful, but does it fly well? Noooooooo, they crash one a day. (ok, i exaggerated a bit there) and the F-16? It looks soooo, beautiful, but take away it's oh-so-precious computer and WHAMMO!!! Scrap  metal!
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Globetrotter on April 23, 2007, 06:49:58 PM
I am sure you do not speak Spanish as well as I do ::)
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Cobra2 on April 24, 2007, 01:40:52 AM
I can speak Spanish  >:D

¡Hey Globetrotter, éste es una traducción pero no la saben! :P

Ahahaha
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Globetrotter on April 24, 2007, 02:03:59 AM
 ;) good cobra, but I meant the ones that criticise me >:D
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Cobra2 on April 24, 2007, 03:37:13 AM
Its just a translation  ;D
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Valiant1 on April 24, 2007, 01:24:30 PM
Oh! Hay algunas personas aqui, en este lugar, que pueden hablar espanol?!!  Bienvenido!!!

Sorry, I only know textbook Spanish, although I am part Spanish and Portugese.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Cobra2 on April 24, 2007, 06:47:12 PM
Welcome to you too Valiant  >:D


But what about Russian?

Эй, но вы можете говорить по-русски? голос Мой любимый самолет Игл F - 15!


Portugese?

Hey, mas pode você falar o Russian? o hehe meu plano favorito é a águia F-15!


French?

Hé, mais pouvez-vous parler russe ? le hehe mon avion préféré est l'aigle F-15 !

German?

He, aber kannst du Russen sprechen? hehe meine Lieblingsfläche ist der Adler F-15!

And finally, English  :)

Hey, but can you speak Russian? hehe  My favorite plane is the F-15 Eagle!

All translation but I do actually know some German words. Not a whole conversation but a small sentence :)



Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on April 25, 2007, 05:29:07 AM
im confused, what is the point of this?
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Valiant1 on April 26, 2007, 04:59:48 AM
Hey Cobra!

THAT was pretty impressive.  you should work for the United Nations as a translator.

I know some Russian, because of friend of mine taught me some.

Kok te poshe vayesh?

Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on April 26, 2007, 05:19:12 AM
pfft you have your russian, german, spanish and whatever else. i speak troll. simple reall. point and grunt, sometimes poke.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on April 26, 2007, 11:55:49 AM
Я полагаю, что мой русский язык лучше тогда ваш, конечно я обманываю. :P
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Flanker.94 on April 27, 2007, 12:32:23 AM
Hey Valiant1! Puedo hablar espanol.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Valiant1 on April 27, 2007, 05:39:17 AM
Hola Flanker,

Y tu? Or are you just joking me?
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on June 01, 2007, 07:10:45 AM
What happened to Valiant?
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on June 01, 2007, 08:59:53 AM
Yeah.. did he delete his account or something?
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on June 23, 2007, 10:18:39 AM
Don't know ask webmaster. And what in the world were they saying? I do German, Greek, wadeva, but not that.

Ah, and Cobra. Babelfish? Some other translation program?
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: valkyrian on June 24, 2007, 11:19:16 AM
Raptor γνωρίζεις την Ελληνική ;
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on June 25, 2007, 09:29:07 AM
So back to the point.. an interesting dogfight..

A Eurocopter Tiger, a AH-64 and a KA-50

DISCUSS::
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: valkyrian on June 26, 2007, 07:51:29 PM
Most effective against ground targets AH-64 D Longbow. Most effective against other helicopters Ka -50 Hocum....this double rotor.......
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: tigershark on June 26, 2007, 08:29:59 PM
I would like to see Gripen vs. Tyhpoon guns only
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: valkyrian on June 27, 2007, 07:31:52 PM
guns only.......the good old fight...then EF all the way every day each day. The Grip, is totally unpowered in comparison with the Tiffy.....so best turning fighter wins and it is Tiffy....

But if you enable a Flanker to jump in, then the Russian pilot will do a stopping cobra, will open his canopy shoot Tiffy in the rear with his PPsh machine gun, then  close the canopy, start the engines and vzzzzzzzzzzz he will go.....
That works as long as the Tiffy pilot is not German! If he is German, then he will remember old Luftwaffe tactics and he may attach a siren to his plane, paint a fake "Stuka"  insignia, turn on his MP3 player that plays Lilly Marlen, and go after the communista...
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on June 29, 2007, 03:04:24 AM
Why the HELL would he be using a PpsH? They went out of fashion in World War 2. Hed most probably use the AKS-74U
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: valkyrian on June 30, 2007, 07:15:51 PM
didn't you notice, that my story is ww2 based?
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on July 01, 2007, 03:46:31 AM
World War 2 with a Flanker, and an MP3 Player? Oh yeah real world war 2.

The guns built into the plane i get, but seriously come on, a hand held SMG that went out of service like 60 years ago?
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on July 03, 2007, 11:09:02 AM
Or the AK-74 on full automatic, or the AN-52 on double burst. (Superb armour piercing, and i'd admit that Russian guns rule any day)

And the plus fact that if a harrier comes in, sits still, then drops vertical... With the Grip and Tiff both firing at if from different ways... Hm, maybe that's a little bit too cartoonish, huh...?
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: valkyrian on July 03, 2007, 08:38:27 PM
Hey guys, i used to play alot medal of honor, and as a Russian i had that ppsh, but as a german i had the superb SG44...and my story was a little cartoonish, like you know the coyotte chasing the roadrunner, reaches the edge of a cliff, stands still, looking to us with pain in face and then goes down...............
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on July 04, 2007, 09:37:27 AM
Meh on MOH or COD i use a rifle.. subs suck.. unless your like 1ft from your target.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on July 06, 2007, 07:38:29 AM
Hey, subs feel a lot safer than slow-firing rifles, or even an MG with huge recoil.

CoD is a huge mix of meelee, sniping, short/long range burst fire, etc, etc. Makes it difficult to select your weapon correctly. I like a mix of any SMG and a Sniper. Preferbly those that reload FAST.

Back to topic, though. I don't really think that's possible, seeing as how the planes will be moving like Mach 0.8-M 1.3 something? Apart from that, the altitude will just freeze you before you manage your first burst of bullets. And, apart from that, low alt is impossible, or you might find the ground scores the most kills on that day.
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Viggen on July 06, 2007, 04:04:03 PM
How about high powered paintball rifles on the jets...?  Repainting the enemies aircraft to pink colour. ;D
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: valkyrian on July 06, 2007, 09:57:35 PM
Paint ball? Maybe water pistols for close in and paintball for....medium range.....i'd love to see a ...pink Flanker......and a Deep Purple  Eagle.....
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Gripen on July 07, 2007, 06:11:36 AM
I wanna see a mettallic blue Gripen with white edges :)
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on July 10, 2007, 12:35:34 PM
I want to see a Red-on-top, white-below Raptor. Heh. Bright pink would be really embarassing to the other pilot. The whole world can see where you are and the ground crew'll laugh their insides out.

Heh. Glow-in-the-dark pink paint
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Viggen on July 10, 2007, 03:53:31 PM
LOL, that pilot will fly the so called "Barbie-Jet".  ;D

A custom paint i would like to see on a Gripen is that black stealth colour like on the Blackbird.  :)
Title: Re: An interesting dogfight
Post by: Raptor on July 11, 2007, 09:50:36 AM
You could always fire "shoot me" bumper stickers. Or you could put "Bandit here!" or maybe "You have a radar lock! Fire!"