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Author Topic: Norway, Britain Monitor Russian Bombers  (Read 12866 times)

Offline tigershark

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Norway, Britain Monitor Russian Bombers
« on: September 08, 2007, 02:52:53 AM »
OSLO, Norway (AP) — Norwegian and British fighters scrambled Thursday to intercept eight Russian bombers that neared the Nordic country's territory in the latest show of air power by the Kremlin, defense officials said.   I don't recall reading about eight bombers at one time during the cold war times but that was a little before my time.

Full story
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5itgdTe9cluhG9cdn65gKMWTLS2Pw

Offline Webmaster

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Re: Norway, Britain Monitor Russian Bombers
« Reply #1 on: September 12, 2007, 12:47:12 PM »
Eight! Wow!  :o Putin is not joking around!

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Offline Viggen

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Re: Norway, Britain Monitor Russian Bombers
« Reply #2 on: September 12, 2007, 02:23:23 PM »
Feels like the old cold war times are back when you read about this. I dont think they are doing this just for fun or excersise. Feels like the russians are up to something.  ;D
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Offline tigershark

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Re: Norway, Britain Monitor Russian Bombers
« Reply #3 on: September 12, 2007, 04:04:05 PM »
To me Putin is trying to rally his people and make them think about the former powerful USSR.   At least some people are smarter and can see and remember the flaws in the old way.   With the right type of setup you could take a long Slammer shot at such a large and basically slow target like a Bear.   Tail chases could be tricky because of the amount of fuel they carried and the speed on which their flying away from a fighter if the fighter were to launch a missile.    I hope nobody dies in these patrols do to aircraft failure because Putin rushes so many of these older aircraft back into service.  Overall I think it's a cool aircraft (Bear) that served it purpose very well over a long period of time.   I would hate to see Bear's used in any modern air combat because fighter pilots would be tripping over themselves to get up and take shots at basically slow non-shooting back targets.   With the right missiles these Bears can still reach out and touch someone.   (Phone commercial in the US)


Offline alyster

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Re: Norway, Britain Monitor Russian Bombers
« Reply #4 on: September 12, 2007, 04:23:11 PM »
Not only do I think it's mistaking theory, but  also dengerous to think Putin only speaks to his own people this way. To tell the truth these flights worry me the least. It's not like Russia doesn't have other means how to strike at US or EU (with nukes). Which worries me is that EU depends on Russian gas and oil. And which worries me is political life in Russia in overall. Who hasn't yet have a look what Freedom House has to say about Russia in 2007, or Russian media. Kinda sad, Russians are usually such a nice people if not to discuss politics or 20th century history with them

BTW were these planes armed this time? I didn't catch it from the news  :-\
« Last Edit: September 12, 2007, 04:32:59 PM by alyster »
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Re: Norway, Britain Monitor Russian Bombers
« Reply #5 on: September 12, 2007, 04:31:40 PM »
Quote
I hope nobody dies in these patrols do to aircraft failure because Putin rushes so many of these older aircraft back into service.

They aren't that old, and they never left service. Bears and Blackjacks have been the nuclear deterrent for years, and the divisions flying these have been financed best of all the Russian forces. And it isn't rushed, long range aviation has resumed training on these types since 1998. And what makes you think they don't shoot back?

You're not afraid of B-52s crashing because of age either, or are you?

Having said that, Tupolev bombers are not the safest planes.

Let's hope none crash because some hot shot US/NATO pilot gets too close!

Alyster, I don't think they were armed, as the only operational armament is still the nuclear Kh-55.

Quote
And which worries me is political life in Russia in overall.

Yeah, same here. Going back to the old ways in terms of state provided welfare services, military and political power isn't too bad for Russia, but taking away more freedoms is bad, especially if they are aimed at stopping any criticism toward the regime.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2007, 04:53:00 PM by Webmaster »
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Offline alyster

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Re: Norway, Britain Monitor Russian Bombers
« Reply #6 on: September 12, 2007, 04:36:12 PM »
Alyster, I don't think they were armed, as the only operational armament is still the nuclear Kh-55.

That's why I asked.
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Offline Globetrotter

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Re: Norway, Britain Monitor Russian Bombers
« Reply #7 on: September 13, 2007, 03:18:49 AM »
wouldn't it be a great idea to put some back-firing R-73 ?? I think there's not much to lose, is it? Even R-77s could be intalled provided you also put a radar on it, which would be expensive, yes, but would almost not need escort of othr planes, would it?
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Offline tigershark

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Re: Norway, Britain Monitor Russian Bombers
« Reply #8 on: September 14, 2007, 02:21:57 AM »
I think there's two different issues:
Quote
alyster
but  also dangerous to think Putin only speaks to his own people this way.   
I never said he only speaks to his people this way to me it's old school politics.  For the old timers, for the un-happy Russians, for the military,  allies, and maybe futures arms purchasers running these flights are a sign of power.   A throw back to Russia's glory days where the USSR would stand up to the USA and runs flights over and near carries, coast lines, and other important ares. 

Quote
Which worries me is that EU depends on Russian gas and oil
Do you mean Russia would withhold oil and gas for EU and former Eastern Block countries?   Is part of the reason for the over flight for that?   This sounds more political then military and I'll be honest I'm not strong in that area and not in the region of the world.

Quote
Webmaster
hey aren't that old, and they never left service. Bears and Blackjacks have been the nuclear deterrent for years, and the divisions flying these have been financed best of all the Russian forces. And it isn't rushed, long range aviation has resumed training on these types since 1998
You may know more about this subject then I but I must admit I don't share your belief for a number of reason, some may be old.
Its hard to believe with all th subs ties up in the docks, and air base having their lights turn off because the military wasn't paying the bills, air force personnel not getting paid for months , that a few squadrons of old prop driven Bear's were maintain over the many grounded interceptors.   It just seems unlikely to me that these aircraft were kept up maybe the Blackjacks but Russia went through some lean times.   I'll admit I may be off a few years in my timing when things were very bad for Russia's armed forces I'm open minded enough to except that I have the wrong time frame in mind.   Correct me if I'm wrong

About the B-52s I'm not afraid because I know their will be a full maintenance detail assigned to every flight that's been trained and has parts to get the job done, and got paid.    I can't feel that way for a Bear that might have work done in late 2005 that's now flying a thousand miles over open ocean because of a President who wants to show the world his country strong again.   To me its a political choice to have these flights in these numbers operational again.   To get pilots and crews air time you can fly over Russia it's huge and never leave the safely of your borders, flying over a naval base in the Indian Ocean is political.

Found this really cool military blog which has good info on this subject I bookmarked for myself
http://geimint.blogspot.com/2007/07/russian-strategic-aviation-imagery.html
« Last Edit: September 14, 2007, 06:54:09 PM by nonpilot »

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Re: Norway, Britain Monitor Russian Bombers
« Reply #9 on: September 14, 2007, 06:19:11 AM »
Could it be a publicity stunt or a way of testing the planes to see if their still combat effective or they could be traingin new pilots?

Could be a completely innocent action. Seems stupid to me that people are jumping down the Russkies throats for deploying thier planes inside their country (they are still in Russian or Russian Allied borders right??) which everyone else seems to do.





Offline alyster

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Re: Norway, Britain Monitor Russian Bombers
« Reply #10 on: September 14, 2007, 01:01:06 PM »
Quote
Do you mean Russia would withhold oil and gas for EU and former Eastern Block countries?   Is part of the reason for the over flight for that?   This sounds more political then military and I'll be honest I'm strong in that area and not in the region of the world.


Well we're getting very political in this non-political forum. However I do not link the flights directly to the energy politics, but energy politics is a weak, if not he weakest point, in the EU. For two reasons: A) We depend on their good will to sell us their oil which we so badly need and hope they will buy our goods, which they don't need so badly. Look at what happened in Ukraine, Georgia or even Belarus. Lithuanian oil refienries haven't recived any drop of oil since they decided to sell their refinery to Polish company, while a Russian company also competed for it. And B) Nord Stream and South Stream are being built to avoid Eastern-European states. This splits EU into two: old western EU and old soviet EU. Currently Putin can not bully Eastern European states with energy because then he'd also stop the supplies to western EU(which would cause strong reaction from major countries like Germany). If they build all the pipelines planned atm, they'd cut EU into two zones and basically splinter it and making it weaker. Of course it's for Russia's benefit(weak EU) and we can't blame them for looking out for their own interests.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2007, 02:36:29 PM by alyster »
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Offline tigershark

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Re: Norway, Britain Monitor Russian Bombers
« Reply #11 on: September 14, 2007, 02:04:17 PM »
Hi alyster
I see what you mean we are getting political in this non-political forum but being totally honest I don't know this stuff.   I didn't know this we call it in the United States blackmail, was going on.   Not a good situation for these governments to be in or the people who live there.   Learn something new every day but for the forum lets get back to military topics.   

Sorry I left out a "not" in my above post I since went back and fixed it.

Did you get a chance and check out the military blog I found about Russian long range aviation?
« Last Edit: September 14, 2007, 06:55:32 PM by nonpilot »

 



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