Funny Gripen joke

[SukhoiLover]

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2009/06/03/327317/gripen-revives-war-of-words-over-norwegian-fighter-assessment.html

The Gripen lost to the F-35 in Noway, nothing new here, but apparently, just recently Gripen International found that Norway conducted simulations which favored the F-35.

Gripen International decided to launch its own simulations to show how good the Gripen is.

According to this simulations the Gripen:

-Wins the Su-35 (BM) in 6:1 ratio

This alone is a joke in my opinion, but the funniest part comes next.

According to Peter Nilsson:  "For JSF it's the other way round" .

Did the guy just say the F-35, a 5th gen fighter looses to the Su-35 in a 6:1 ratio while their cripple Gripen manages to get 6:1 against the Su-35?

He did.

Tell me guys, isn´t that the funniest joke you ever heard? Or maybe its not a joke but rather a desperate move from acompany that produces an aircraft that clearly falls behind all current fighter that we see out there in the market.

[Viggen]

Why would this be a joke? They are talking about the Next generation of Gripen, the Meteor and IRIS missiles. They combined clearly outclass the Su-35 and the JSF.

SAAB´s Statment from 2008-12-10 about Norways faulty and incomplete tests.
http://feed.ne.cision.com/wpyfs/00/00/00/00/00/0D/D9/F5/wkr0009.pdf

[F-111 C/C]

I would choose the NG Gripen over the F-35 and Su-35 but that's just me. It seems it's Politics as usual with the choice of the F-35. There is A LOT more involved in their decision than what is the best plane but it's unfortunate thay have to hide behind false or skewed data to justify their decision.

[Viggen]

I would choose the NG Gripen over the F-35 and Su-35 but that's just me. It seems it's Politics as usual with the choice of the F-35. There is A LOT more involved in their decision than what is the best plane but it's unfortunate thay have to hide behind false or skewed data to justify their decision.

Of course its about politics. SAAB offered Norway 48 Gripens for free, as a gift and they denied the package.  I think the US offer was probably better for Norway economically in the long run. Thats why the choose the JSF and not because it was the better aircraft.

[Gripen]

Pretty sure the stupid F35 isnt even in service yet, and the Gripen is and has for how many years now? So Norway said no to a great fighter that they could've had parked at their air bases ready to go defend their country by the end of the year, where as the F35 wont be ready for atleast 2 years, probably closer to 5? Idiotic much??

I really hope the F35 turns out to be a huge failure, everyone is drooling over what it could do, not what it does do.

 

[SukhoiLover]

Well guys, i totally disagree with you.

First of all, even packed with Meteor plus Iris-T missiles and cutting edge AESA radar, 6:1 ratio is still exaggerated when you compare the Gripen vs Su-35, furthermore, i question these kinds of simulation since nobody knows what are the real numbers of such important factor as the new Su-35 true RCS, etc.

But what surprises me the most is that people continues to underestimate the F-35´s true potential.

Viggen, do you truly believe that a NG Gripen can outclass a 5th gen stealth fighter in BVR combat?
I think your being very naive.

Even with a Top notch radar it would be extremely hard to the Gripen, or any other 4th gen fighter, to pick up a stealth fighter on the radar, and even more to successfully tracking it and shoot.

By the time they see the F-35 or F-22 on their radar is already too late, they probably have been shoot at already.

Its a mater of logic, imagine a scenario were they are using the exact same radar, even in such situation the fact is the Gripen, no matter how Small his RCS is, will be picked up first.

Honestly, i don´t change my position, after the F-22 and the F-35, the only fighter aircraft that can come close to them are the Su-35 and the Eurofighter.

To me, those 4 aircraft stand out from the rest, pick up a Block 60 F-16 put some new engines on  it, a new radar and use some new materials to reduce some weight and you get a plane which outclasses the Gripen.
Even the Rafale earns more respect from me than the Gripen.

The Gripen is only a good choice for a country low on budget and with few runways.

If you have the money and you have the airfields and you got the chance to get a 5th gen fighter, than get it, trading it for a 4th gen fighter just because it is cheap and the company offers 48 for free is stupid and would turn out to be a really bad decision in a long term.

Something similar is happening in Australia, the have the money to get the F-22 and they certainly have the "political status" to get the F-22 and yet they want to get the F-35.

Why do you get the Mercedes when you have the chance to get the Ferrari?

Thats ridiculous.

In the end the Norwegian were smart enough to not commit such mistake, and i praise  them for that.

Its not a matter of politics, its a matter of getting the best when you have a chance to.

[Viggen]

You are certanly right to have your own oppinion and i do agree with you on some of the points. Like taking on aircraft with stealth ability. However im not so sure the F-35 will live up to its name. With all its advanced technoligy it must cost a fortune to service and upgrade the aircraft by time and i belive they overestimete its preformance. Ok, they have probably exaggerated the ratio, but i would not bet my life on thinking the stealth capability will save me. Its just another tool but it cant fool heatseaking missiles.

The F16 is a nice fighter, but i think they have done as much as possible with it. More upgrades will not be costeffective compared to its preformance. This one, the NG Gripen wins big. Yes, it is supposed to be a low budget aircraft, but it is also a very advanced and reliable 4´th gen multirole aircraft of the highets quality. You get alot of bang for the buck. The NG Gripen will be a totally diffrent aircraft compared to todays Gripen. This is the one they should of built right from the start.

Im not just defending the Gripen becuse its Swedish. I dont think they would of built it in the first place if they were not sure of its preformance and that it would outclass the F16 Falcon. It would of just been cheaper for Sweden to by F16´s if it would be the better aircraft suited for our country´s purpose.

Eurofighter was developed and payed for by four countries, without them working together there would not of been any Typhoon´s. Its definatly one of the best that are in service today. I cant speak for the Raphale, since i know too little about it. But the French are known for making outstanding aircraft.

PS. If you are going on a longer trip by car, you dont buy the Ferrari. You buy the Mercedes. 

[AVIATOR]

Well guys, i totally disagree with you.



Viggen, do you truly believe that a NG Gripen can outclass a 5th gen stealth fighter in BVR combat?
I think your being very naive.

Even with a Top notch radar it would be extremely hard to the Gripen, or any other 4th gen fighter, to pick up a stealth fighter on the radar, and even more to successfully tracking it and shoot.

By the time they see the F-35 or F-22 on their radar is already too late, they probably have been shoot at already.

Its a mater of logic, imagine a scenario were they are using the exact same radar, even in such situation the fact is the Gripen, no matter how Small his RCS is, will be picked up first.

Not to mention the F-35s, F-22s and the RAAF F-18 Super Hornet's Growler technology, which will send all opposition back to the Korean war era.

[SukhoiLover]

You are certanly right to have your own oppinion and i do agree with you on some of the points. Like taking on aircraft with stealth ability. However im not so sure the F-35 will live up to its name. With all its advanced technoligy it must cost a fortune to service and upgrade the aircraft by time and i belive they overestimete its preformance. Ok, they have probably exaggerated the ratio, but i would not bet my life on thinking the stealth capability will save me. Its just another tool but it cant fool heatseaking missiles.

The F16 is a nice fighter, but i think they have done as much as possible with it. More upgrades will not be costeffective compared to its preformance. This one, the NG Gripen wins big. Yes, it is supposed to be a low budget aircraft, but it is also a very advanced and reliable 4´th gen multirole aircraft of the highets quality. You get alot of bang for the buck. The NG Gripen will be a totally diffrent aircraft compared to todays Gripen. This is the one they should of built right from the start.

Im not just defending the Gripen becuse its Swedish. I dont think they would of built it in the first place if they were not sure of its preformance and that it would outclass the F16 Falcon. It would of just been cheaper for Sweden to by F16´s if it would be the better aircraft suited for our country´s purpose.

Eurofighter was developed and payed for by four countries, without them working together there would not of been any Typhoon´s. Its definatly one of the best that are in service today. I cant speak for the Raphale, since i know too little about it. But the French are known for making outstanding aircraft.

PS. If you are going on a longer trip by car, you dont buy the Ferrari. You buy the Mercedes. 

I don´t deny that the Gripen has some very good qualities, and i admit it is a great achievement specially when you think it was made by such a small country.
In fact, Sweden is even smaller than Portugal in terms of population, so the Gripen is a major achievement.

But its like i said, even though it is a very advanced 4th gen fighter ( specially the NG ), the fact is that in some parameters we can´t compare it, or any other fighter, to 5th gen fighters.

You can take the Ferrari on the longer trip, after all, you´ll get there faster, only difference is the cost in long term.

But hey, if you know that your neighbors have some Porches, you certainly don´t want a Mercedes to compete with them.

[Gripen]

Something similar is happening in Australia, the have the money to get the F-22 and they certainly have the "political status" to get the F-22 and yet they want to get the F-35.

WRONG!!!

Australia did try to get the F22, but the beloved idiots on Capitol Hill decided that the F22 wasnt going to be exported. And, even then, we still probably wouldnt have got the -22 because it doesnt have the same ground attack capability (even though its all theoretical at the moment because the F35 hasnt been tested) as the F35.



Only c*ckheads by Ferraris, they show off because their lacking in the downstairs area. Id rather a Mercedes over a Ferrari anyday.

Also, if you neighbours have Porches, by a Mercedes;

"My friends all drive Porshes, I must make amends, oh lord, wont you buy me a Mercedes Benz?" - Janis Joplin..I think?

[SukhoiLover]

Something similar is happening in Australia, the have the money to get the F-22 and they certainly have the "political status" to get the F-22 and yet they want to get the F-35.

WRONG!!!

Australia did try to get the F22, but the beloved idiots on Capitol Hill decided that the F22 wasnt going to be exported. And, even then, we still probably wouldnt have got the -22 because it doesnt have the same ground attack capability (even though its all theoretical at the moment because the F35 hasnt been tested) as the F35.



Only c*ckheads by Ferraris, they show off because their lacking in the downstairs area. Id rather a Mercedes over a Ferrari anyday.

Also, if you neighbours have Porches, by a Mercedes;

"My friends all drive Porshes, I must make amends, oh lord, wont you buy me a Mercedes Benz?" - Janis Joplin..I think?

Gripen, i think you get what i´m saying, no matter how good Gripen is, its just inferior to 5th gen fighter, end of discussion as far as i´m concerned.

Actually, be honest with me, what would  relieve you the most, knowing that Australia is protected by NG Gripen or F-35´s?

[AVIATOR]

I'll answer it. F-35s because simply they are manufactured by our Anzus ally.
Remember what the rabble were shouting out from one side of the road when Lady Godiva rode side saddle in the procession?     "Hurrah for our side".