MILAVIA Forum
Military Aviation => Military Aircraft => Topic started by: Viggen on April 18, 2005, 01:00:10 PM
-
Vote now my friends. I personally vote for JA37. ;D
-
What a surprise there Viggen... ;D
I agree with you though, the old JA-37 is just a brute, I love it.
-
The Viggen got one of the most beautiful layouts of all delta's. And I am just in love with the tandem gear. All the different versions make it interesting as well. The Gripen is a nice little aircraft and without doubt best choice for any low budget air force seeking a modern economic yet multirole and very capable aircraft, but like the F-16, it's boring. ;D
-
BORING!???...oooh that's a bit harsh!... ;)
OK it doesn't have the character of the Viggen but boring?...I hope no-one from Saab is reading this or they'll get all depressed... ;D
-
Nah, they'll be fine, look at the export customers compared to the other fourth generation fighters. Maybe a bit harsh, but compared to the Viggen, it really is. I've seen both aircraft performing at airshows, the Viggen takes your breath away, the Gripen is just another fighter doing its routine. Maybe it would be a bit better if they gave it the splinter camoflage. :P
-
Hi guy´s, nice to see that many of you took the poll and a thanks to Niels for moving it to the right place. I also have to say that im sorry to Niels that i´ve been away for so long and havent finished the whole work on the viggen-project. I wrote the JA37 part for him on this website. I lost my old job, now im back again with a new job and a new email.
Yes Viggen is brutal and Gripen is a bit lame compared to it. Just the sound from the engine makes you relize that viggen is oldschool, built during the coldwar. While Gripen is a bit more silent and high tech and dont express the same kind of charisma.
But im sure it can handel very well in a dogfight.
::)
-
Hey there guys....
-
Sorry about that last one, I somehow hit the post button. but as I was saying I was agree that the JA 37 is a beautiful plane. Not to say that the Gripen is not a nice plane itself. But I would agree that it is the Viggen all the way!
-
It does have a lot to do with the noise I reckon. The sound of that brutish engine in the Viggen is enough to send chills up the spine. Like the howling sound you get from an F104, that's another beautiful noise.
-
I think the Viggen looks better and has that brutish look kinda like an F-4 Phantom compared to a Falcon, one is more capable but the predecessor is definitely more beautiful!!!
-
Right, F-4 vs F-16 on looks, and I would prefer the F-4 ;D
-
Again i have to agree with you guys about the F4 Phantom, in some sort of way the fighters from the 50´s and 60´s are more beautiful. At the moment im thinking of the experimental Glamorous Glennis, it dosent look like much. But it sure broke through the soundbarrier, raw power. :D
-
Hello Guys,
The Viggen and the Phantom are winning this contest by far, if you just go for the looks..... :P
To bad the Viggen is going to leave service....... :'(
Best Regards, Ramon.
-
My vote is for the Viggen too. I love that aircraft and I´m thinking in build one on a 1/72 scale. Long life for the Viggen.
-
The F-4 beautiful???...I think you lot need new glasses!!!... 8)
That is one of the most Butt-ugly planes they ever built...and I love it!... ;D
All the older jets have so much more character than their skinny bland replacements...Bring back the century series jets I say.
-
The F4 is cool and thats final... ;)
Well, im back again. Had a bad cold for a week. Been laying in bed (sofa) watching movies. Iron Eagle, Top Gun and so on... My joystick went beserk..No more FS 2004 until i can afford a new one. So you can say i had a shitty end of the month.
I uploaded a few pics from an airshow at F17 Kallinge last year (viggen, gripen). You can see the diffrence in size between the two fighters compared to people standing next to them. :D
-
INFORMATION ABOUT SAAB 37 VIGGEN
Role: Fighter, Bomber, Reconnaissance
Builder: Saab Aerospace
Variants: AJ 37, SK 37, SK 37E, SH 37, SF 37, JA 37, AJS 37
Operators: Sweden
The construction of JA37 started as late as 1968 and flew the first time in 1977. The first JA37 Viggen was delivered to the Swedish Air Force in 1979. This aircraft was made especially in mind for Swedish air force specifications about STOL. The Swedish airforce needed a high quality all weather fighter, able to take off and land on short strips. The system builds on using regular roads as landing/take off strips spread out around the country, making it harder for an enemy to defeat the fighters on the ground during reloading, service and refuelling. The first delivery to the Swedish airforce was the year 1979 and the last one 1990. JA37 is the fifth member of the Viggen family. Viggen is built out of aluminium, honeycomb-elements and titanium-reinforcements. JA37 Viggen is the only aircraft in the Viggen family equipped with a head-down-display from Smiths Industries. It makes it possible for the pilot to fly in any kind of weather. Totally 329 Viggen were built, 149 of then are JA37´s. Of those 149 aircraft, 115 will be modified to AJS 37 Viggen.
Many of the functions in Viggen are automated, to help the pilot and so he can work comfortably. Examples of this are the automatic cannon. Once the pilot has his target locked on radar, the aircraft will steer itself so that every round will hit its target. The cockpit in Viggen is a relaxed environment; automatic throttle helps the pilot to keep an optimum speed, altitude and angel at short and steep landings. You can land at speeds between 195-249km/h (121-154 mph) with an aoa (Angel of attack) 16, 5 degrees.
Once the landing gear hits the ground and presses together, the reversing function sets in. This is optional, the pilot may choose to use the reversing system manually is he so wishes. The Viggen has a unique reversing system built in, which helps it to keep the landings under 500 meters. It also results in that the pilot can go backwards with his aircraft without any external help. This is always appreciated amongst the audience during airshows and gets a lot of applauses. The Tornado and Viggen are the only tactical fighters in the world equipped with this system. The rear landing gear is very wide, which gives the aircraft more stability on the ground, either you taxi, take off or land.
Specifications:
Dimensions: Length 16,40m (53, 80 ft); Width 10,60m (34, 77 ft); Height 5,90m (19, 35 ft)
Speed: High Altitude Mach 2.0 +; Low Altitude 1410 km/h (876, 13 mph)
Weights Weight empty 12200kg (26896 Ib); Normal start weight 16 800kg (37037 Ib); Max start weight 22 500kg (49604 Ib);
Powerplant: Volvo Aero RM8B (JT8d-22) turbofan with afterburner; Thrust without afterburner 7350 kp (1066 PSI); Thrust with afterburner 12750 kp (1849, 23 PSI)
Radar: Ericsson PS-46/A, X-band, Puls-Doppler.
Armament: This is an example of an armament. 30mm automatic cannon from Oerlikon (150 rounds).1340 rounds/minute.1030 m/s (202755 ft/min). Two Sky flash missiles (RB71), it’s an improved version of AIM-7 sparrow. Four Sidewinder missiles (RB24), and an external fuel tank.
-
Thanks for the information Air Marshall, but if you would be really intrested in this site, you would of noticed that MILAVIA already has that info under the aircraft section.....
And guess what? Our dear Webmaster also have several other aircraft with lots of information we can read about. Check it out! ;)
-
We all have different taste and thats a good thing. So i welcome all Gripen lovers to share there view here.
Thanks for your oppinion RecceJet. :)
-
Air Marshall, I already gave you a message on posting replies like this a while ago. Please there is no need to copy the data from one page of my website onto the forum. I think I made it fairly easy to find. Then the photo, which is also copied from my Viggen section. You can use it for limited personal use only. But with a source I don't mind that you post it here. However it seems you have even cropped and removed the copyright line? http://www.milavia.net/aircraft/viggen/gallery/viggen_15.htm You know, that would be against copyright law.
But the main thing is, that these posts are not neccessary.
They disrupt the discussion. If you post data, just use a link to the page instead or post it as a quote, and mention the source. So we at least know somebody else wrote it.
-
About Air Marshall´s posting. It was pretty funny to read my own written words... :)
But there is a some rules to follow and respect other members, so we all get along here on this great place.
-
Vote now my friends. I personally vote for JA37. ;D
Dear Viggen
Wiith respect the correct word is SAB 37 VIGGEN not " JA37 " .... :D
-
Air Marshall, I already gave you a message on posting replies like this a while ago. Please there is no need to copy the data from one page of my website onto the forum. I think I made it fairly easy to find. Then the photo, which is also copied from my Viggen section. You can use it for limited personal use only. But with a source I don't mind that you post it here. However it seems you have even cropped and removed the copyright line? http://www.milavia.net/aircraft/viggen/gallery/viggen_15.htm You know, that would be against copyright law.
But the main thing is, that these posts are not neccessary.
They disrupt the discussion. If you post data, just use a link to the page instead or post it as a quote, and mention the source. So we at least know somebody else wrote it.
Ok Sir...... ;)
-
Thanks for the information Air Marshall, but if you would be really intrested in this site, you would of noticed that MILAVIA already has that info under the aircraft section.....
And guess what? Our dear Webmaster also have several other aircraft with lots of information we can read about. Check it out! ;)
I understand.......Ok but this is the requirement to Qoute the information about specific topic.... :)
-
Dear Viggen this Image for u..... Check it
http://members.home.nl/hamhendriks/downloads/ja37di_37428_800.jpg
-
Dear Viggen
Wiith respect the correct word is SAB 37 VIGGEN not " JA37 " .... :D
Back again, after being away for a week..
My sweet little Air marshall the correct word is SAAB not SAB, and if you read about the fighter then you would know what role the JA37 Viggen plays.
By the way, thanks for the pic. :)
-
HOLD EVERYTHING! :o I could swear I voted for the JAS39, but according to the poll its 8 : 0. Did my vote get lost somehow? I do realise I'm a very small minority... please don't take my one and only vote away :'( I know I have bad taste in aircraft... I promise to change :-[
-
HOLD EVERYTHING! :o I could swear I voted for the JAS39, but according to the poll its 8 : 0. Did my vote get lost somehow? I do realise I'm a very small minority... please don't take my one and only vote away :'( I know I have bad taste in aircraft... I promise to change :-[
Maybe you clicked the wrong one by mistake, or as you said it got lost.
Anyway, there is one vote then for Gripen. I keep that in mind. :)
-
Back again, after being away for a week..
My sweet little Air marshall the correct word is SAAB not SAB, and if you read about the fighter then you would know what role the JA37 Viggen plays.
By the way, thanks for the pic. :)
Ha Ha Ok dont worry....... ;D
-
Im not worried, but you have a point.
Maybe i should of writtet "AJS", since its the newest model in the viggen series. The majority of the rest is going to the scrapyard. :'(
Probably thats why i keep hanging on to the good old JA37 model. Developed only for air to air combat, a beast that turn your head and drop you to the knees when its passing above you at low altitude. And probably the only fighter in the world that managed to get a missilelock and fire it on the SR71 Blackbird.
;D
-
I vote for JAS-39 Super Gripen with the EJ200 engine!
I am new and I would like to share this interesting e-mail:
Dear Mr. Ioannidis,
Thank you for your e-mail.
Saab has years ago already investigated the technical and operational
feasibility for re-engineering JAS 39 Gripen with the EJ200 engine.
Both Saab and EUROJET Turbo GmbH concluded that a re-engineering only
shall be considered if there is a customer demand available. From a
technical point of view, the EJ200 engine would fit into the engine bay
of JAS39 Gripen with minor changes applied to the interface connections.
The commercial feasibility of re-engineering JAS39 Gripen would be
supported, if required, by individual business case calculations.
The Thrust vectoring nozzle is offered as an optional item for any of
the EJ200 engine standards.
I hope this answer can help.
Yours sincerely,
Katarina Elbogen
Katarina Elbogen
Executive PR and Political Affairs
EUROJET Turbo GmbH
Lilienthalstr. 2b
85339 Hallbergmoos
E-Mail: k.elbogen@eurojet.de
-----Original Message-----
From: EJ200@eurojet.de [mailto:EJ200@eurojet.de]
Sent: 22 August 2005 14:22
To: EJ200
Subject: Contact Form
******************************************************************
***** This mail message was transmitted via Internet *****
******************************************************************
E U R O J E T C O N T A C T F O R M
-------------------------------------------------------------
COMPANY:
NAME / FIRSTNAME : Athanasios Ioannidis
STREET / NR: Melandias 10
POSTAL CODE / PLACE: 171 21 Nea Smyrni, Athens, Greece
TELEPHONE :
FAX :
E-MAIL : nassos83@hotmail.com
COMMENTS : Dear Eurojet Turbo,
One of your partners, ITP of Spain, has developed a 3 dimensional TVC
nozzle for EJ200, and also, the company has designed a nozzle for JAS-39
Gripen. It is said that SAAB JAS-39 Gripen will, in the future, be
equiped with this engine. Although the replacement of the Volvo RM12 is
going to cost, do you believe that there is a possibility of an
EJ200-powered Gripen?
I look forward to hearing from you.
Sincerely,
Athanasios Ioannidis
Student
I hope Greece will have as a single engine the Gripen and NOT the JSF!! Not to mention that we already fly the Erieye...
-
Welcome to the forum! Very interesting indeed, thank you for sharing.
-
I believe SAAB must sell this specific aircraft. But I also think that the Svenska Flygvapnet MUST reengine their JAS-39 A/B/C/D Gripens. It is going to cost however, but I've heard that the RM12 is not so good. The Viggen's engine, though commercial, it still is a superb one! It is a pity that there wasn't such an engine back in the 80's for the size of the Gripen.
-
Truly intersting, its now under investigation. Hoping to get an answer today. :)
-
I never got any answers from Volvo Aero/Gripen International, which i find very intresting. From this i think that our friend "Greekpilot" may have right. Either they are trying like hell to fix the problems with the engine or going to make the change to a new engine. They are usally fast to reject any critisism about the Gripen-fighter, but as i wrote earlier. No answers at all, all doors on this subject are currently closed and locked. >:(
-
Viggen, I got an answer from Volvo Flygmotor, but I cannot attach it due to information disclosures, e-mail publication limitations etc from the company. They just told me that:
1) There are no such plans (???)
2) That EJ200 is not developed for single engine (in the Eurojet site it says it can be used!)
Conclusion: Something is not right. That is why I came in contact with EuroJet Turbo GmbH and they replied me with the message above.
Who knows...
And Gripen International will never reply, unless they create the FAQ webpage. There I asked them about any potential Gripen offer to Greece and which version (eg. Super Gripen)
BTW Gripen will be demonstrated on the Archangel 2005 Airshow at Tanagra AB.
-
Go Gripen! The "39" is ,what the F-16 was supposed to grow up into( although adv. avionics make the f-16 a slightly better ground attacker) The JAS 39 is what a light attck and interceptor acft should be, speed ,agility,low radar signature.The Indian Air force claims that its LCA will exceed the abilities of the Gripen, but I sincerely doubt it.If I were in the market as a small country with a decent military budget, I'd by the JAS 39 , a few MIG 29 updates, and a few F/A-18s for ground pounding and naval ops.
-
To bad you cant share that email, would love to take a look at it. As it is now, it just builds up the feeling that something is going on with the engine.
I do belive the Greek goverment will make the right choice when buying a new fighter, Gripen or not. But if i remember correctly Greece is a member of NATO. Just that little detail ends with that a country will have to buy US-built fighters. 8)
-
Sounds like the Greeks will end up with the F-16 or the F/A-18 ( I think those are the cheapest to get their hands on) but the Grippen CAN DOG FIGHT within the level of the F-16, although the F/A-18 has better ground attack and BVR qualities.Canada,New Zealand and Australia use the F/A-18 as an "air superiority" fighter (scary ,huh?), and until the JSF comes on line,you'll see more of those acfts in the world sales competition.While the Russians sale new to old stuff, Euro nations give ther ols stuff away and sell newer systems, the U.S. has a habit of trying to market it old stuff ( stripped down) as if its a "garage sale"..... :(
-
F/A-18 is not suitable for dogfights in the Aegean Sea. HAF officials explained to me that the y evaluated in the 1980's and it was then heavy. The Super Hornet is also heavy, though more powerful. We will end up with Typhoon. I hope we will get the EJ200 powered Super Gripen in the near future, but it will depend on HAF evaluation, politics, and budgetary limitations. I am sure that, if selected, Gripen International will provide high offset programmes (SAAB already cooperates with Greek HAI on Neuron programme).
BTW, this link
http://www.gripen.com/download/18.1552b76fb842c03177fff698/AirInternational-March2003.pdf
shows that Gripen's wheels, tyres and braking system are British. Unless they belong to Dunlop, subsidiary of Goodyear. Any ideas ???
-
Sounds like the Greeks will end up with the F-16 or the F/A-18 ( I think those are the cheapest to get their hands on) but the Grippen CAN DOG FIGHT within the level of the F-16, although the F/A-18 has better ground attack and BVR qualities.Canada,New Zealand and Australia use the F/A-18 as an "air superiority" fighter (scary ,huh?), and until the JSF comes on line,you'll see more of those acfts in the world sales competition.While the Russians sale new to old stuff, Euro nations give ther ols stuff away and sell newer systems, the U.S. has a habit of trying to market it old stuff ( stripped down) as if its a "garage sale"..... :(
the RAAF uses the Hornet for everything...its pathetic...i still think the Gripen is better then the Viggen...VIggen is being mostly retired is it not, while the Gripen is just coming into service...the Viggen is a good plane, but with everything, it gets old and the SAAB peoples should proud...