Should the F/A-22 Raptor be offered for export?

[aircop38]

quite simply "no"- copies of the "raptor" will sooner or later end up stripped down ( by China or Russia )anyway- so why sell it and allow for cheap copy cats to be made- the Mig 29s ,SU-27s and SU-30s  are still a preoblem , and good old U.S. tech- though only a few steps ahead, is none the less ahead and should stay that way !The allies- are happy with block 40/50 F-16s as well as the F/A 18C/Es,the improved F-15D-Ls ,and the UK, Germany,and France have the choice of Rafales or the Euro fighter,as well as some good stuff coming out of SAAB,so why even the feild- the F-15 and its smaller sibling,the f-16 ruled the roost for at least 20 yrs,and the U.S hasn't had a capable dog fighter since the P-51 and the F-86( the F-4 phantom was the American equivalent to a suped up grocery getter and its far superior replacement ,the F-14,has been kicked to the curb for the sake of modern $$ spending!).I say ,we build a better killing machine and let the rest catch up................

[Webmaster]

Maybe, but not all allies, but I guess that's why we have the F-35 JSF option as well. It's a shame though that experiences with countries as Iran and now maybe Venezuela  will mean far better, more reliable and stable allies get the 'no' on the Raptor but also on Technology Transfer and Software codes to modify according to specific needs (remember recent UK-US row over the JSF tech transfer.)

I say ,we build a better killing machine and let the rest catch up................

Ah, ok, but then don't come and complain that your allies are lagging behind technology wise and cooperation was crap because of it! With the current (and for a while continiuing) political climate, the US can not fight wars on its own, it won't be accepted. They want allies in as well, maybe not for their capabilities but for their political support. And let your allies develop their own systems, but when something revolutionary comes from the European the US are quick to intervene, threathen, or at least distort possible sales to foreign countries that are not kissing Bush's behind.

Then finally another perspective... I think we all know the saying keeps your friends close, but your enemies closer. OR something like this... if you bring this into the argument, it might be actually good to export high tech planes and weapons, and you won't be surprised by any Su-27 derivaties and other capable foreign planes.This is of course a precarious argument..., but think about it..., I am putting my hand in the fire now...tricky example but what if the US supplied the Iraqi insurgents (or whatever you want to call them) with anti-vehicle mines... wouldn't that make it easier for the troops than now having to cope with IEDs (inprovised explosive devices)...


@ Tomcatboy: I'm in the Netherlands... Sweden soon...

[aircop38]

Well you are right on one point. The most common excuse they use of the vietnam war is: They won the battles but lost the war.

But i think  all that  "chest out, flex your biceps"  mentality from the cold war era have stayed with US goverment. Thou rest of the world have adapted to a more relaxed way of life.  Guess thats why many countries find them insulting.

Yeah,it has - but if the "rest" of the world would  stop fence sitting and DO something about the crack pot despots in the World and the potential threat they bring( like Irans prez and that tyrant in Nor Korea) you would see so much "U.S. meddling"- it only takes a "few" yrs for you Euros to forget- in your grandparents time- everybody thought that leave well enough alone mentality,until "uncle Adolf" was either sitting in your kitchen or had his nazi goons sharpening their bayonets at your front doors!Waiting until you SEE a threat is usually TOO LATE.The U.S. is inspired by REAL history.It sat back after WWI and stayed out of "way"-Hitler and the japanese War machine nearly took over the world.And of course you all seem to forget that Stalin was threatening you right after  WW2-and his gov;t continued to threaten West europe until Ron Reagan and the "insulting" U.S of A closed the book on  Commie Russia-many of your nations have never had to taste war or threat of it thanks to "American Muscle flexing".We also learned a lesson from vietnam-PLAY TO WIN-SCREW WORLD OPINION. HAD we bombed the commie North right away like we did in '72,we'd have beaten them-worrying about nations who aren't stepping up to make sure the rest of the world is safe is a joke-so sue us if we act selfish and rude- our idea of defense is to go over in our neighbors yard and kill his pest problem so that it  doesn't end up in ours-even if our nieghbor is too dumb or cowardly, or lazy or uncaring to do something about the problem.......

[alyster]

I've seen the "Soviet Muscle flexing", if it's anything like US'es, then god help the people towars who they flex!!

I sencierly hope that EU will grow stronger in military strenght, cause US is out of control.

You know they bombed Fallujah with white phosphoruse 

[Raptor]

I've seen the "Soviet Muscle flexing", if it's anything like US'es, then god help the people towars who they flex!!

I sencierly hope that EU will grow stronger in military strenght, cause US is out of control.

You know they bombed Fallujah with white phosphoruse

I think the EU is powerful enough. In it's own sense. And, correct me if i'm wrong, but wasn't it the Soviet's brute force that eventually ran them dry and finally, a major loss to the USA???

[alyster]

The military was still strong, but in the end of 1980s and begining of 1990s they were afreid to use it against crowds in larger scale.

[Raptor]

Hmmm. Thanks. I still wonder, though, selling the best fighter of the time is a bit much...

[alyster]

In 10-15 years there will be a new best one 

Better sell them to japs and make some profit.

[Raptor]

No doubt about it. I'm sure the Japs are just itching to get their hands on it.

Maybe waiting a while for the USAF fleet to grow a bit first, then selling it would be wiser. After all, if the USAF has only a small number, they would be unable to maintain air superiority over the other nations with a weapon of the same power and potency.

[Valiant1]

NEVER EVER SELL THE F-22 UNTIL IT BECOMES REALLY OLD TECHNOLOGY!!!

[Cobra2]

Lot of Fighter Jets, Personals, Missiles etc win's its war.

But Viatnam war not wins by USA.

Its not just our number. Its our militarys will to do whats right. Its our militarys superior technology. Its our training, its our members bravery and duty and many, many other things. and about Vietnam, our ground losses were heavy for what? not for us but for them. And can someone tell me our current relations with South Vietnam?

[alyster]

NEVER EVER SELL THE F-22 UNTIL IT BECOMES REALLY OLD TECHNOLOGY!!!

Deal! Let germany and uk sell their typhoon, france sell their rafael and sweeds sell their Jas-39 to everyone who currently are looking at US techs. And what would be left of US economy then?

Only the Israeli and Hizbullah conflict brough in for US $319 million and some more probably.