MILAVIA Forum - Military Aviation Discussion Forum

Author Topic: RNLAF Open Days 2007 (Volkel AB)  (Read 11646 times)

Offline Ramon

  • Scorpion Aviation Photography
  • Global Moderator
  • Fighter Ace
  • *******
  • Posts: 339
  • Country: nl
RNLAF Open Days 2007 (Volkel AB)
« on: April 09, 2007, 04:04:18 PM »
Hello guys,

This years Open door days of the RNLAF are held at the Volkel AB.
I will not be the large and MEGA show of last year, which will be very hard to beat
in the coming years. But hear again a very nice list with participants, all confirmed:

Display Teams:
- Royal Jordanian Falcons
- Patrouille de France
- Turkisch Stars
- 2Excel team
- Pilatus PC7 Team

Solo Display:
- RNLAF F-16 Solo
- BAF F-16 Solo
- Swiss F-18 Hornet Solo

Very special aircrafts, all flying:
- BAe Canberra (B2/B6 Hybrid)
- Fouga Magister
- Pilatus PC-21

Furthermore are sure that the Red Arrows and the Frecce Tricollori will not be there.
If the list will grow like last year, than the RNLAF airshow is again a highlight.

Regards, Ramon.
  • Interests: A-10, F-14, F-105, B-58 and warbirds

Offline Webmaster

  • MILAVIA Webmaster
  • Administrator
  • General of Flight
  • *******
  • Posts: 2842
  • Country: nl
Re: RNLAF Open Days 2007 (Volkel AB)
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2007, 03:49:20 PM »
I am a bit sceptical about this year's open days. Volkel has pretty much disappointed me over the years when the line-up is concerned. I hope the above list will have some more exciting stuff added. Volkel had always the problem of having the static display in front of the showline, as well as the VIP tent. Leeuwarden or Gilze are much better suited for a large scale event as this. Like you said, it won't be as large and exciting as last year at Leeuwarden.  I wouldn't be suprised at all, if a lot of negative feedback will be posted at the Dutch spotter sites after the show.

Having said that, I am sure it will be a great air show as always, and we have to be thankful for such great open days the RNLAF puts up, with free entrance. Maybe this one will be just a little less interesting for me again.

I am not suprised that they didn't get those teams, but I've seen the Reds many times, so I don't mind. Turkish stars is a nice change. I also see a lot of 'boring' displays though, RJ Falcons, 2 Excel and we'll probably have a solo Extra display as well. That's three slots taken up by small prop stunt planes. Not my thing.  ::)

Maybe it's an idea for the RNLAF to organise a small dissimilar combat exercise, inviting all new NATO members, in the week before the show. Then we would see some MiGs and Gripens. It also seems that the RNLAF needs to work on their relation with the Luftwaffe, RAF, SwAF, AdlA some more, IMHO, we are in the JSF program, but why not exchange more info on the Typhoon, Gripen, Rafale. We haven't seen those since the companies displayed them but the JSF got picked instead. I would imagine that the RNLAF would like to get to know more about these aircraft for cooperation in missions and as possible alternatives. Wake up, we haven't bought those JSFs yet! Not everyone we need to cooperate with will buy it! And the final price tag will suprise us!

I guess my underlying point is, why doesn't the RNLAF do more exchange programs and exercises to build knowledge, experience and contacts? Why not send an F-16 squadron to Poland, Slovakia, and I don't know Bulgaria for example. They'd love to learn more about the F-16, not to mention our helicopter force. I don't know, it just seems to me that the RNLAF is getting a bit isolated in its role as NATO/US ally.
  • Interests: Su-15, Su-27, Tu-22, Tornado, RNLAF
Niels Hillebrand
MILAVIA Webmaster

Offline Ramon

  • Scorpion Aviation Photography
  • Global Moderator
  • Fighter Ace
  • *******
  • Posts: 339
  • Country: nl
Re: RNLAF Open Days 2007 (Volkel AB)
« Reply #2 on: April 26, 2007, 01:44:38 AM »
Hello Niels,

Completely agree that it will be a smaller airshow this year, and compared to Leeuwarden an airshow that not can be
reached by Volkel. The RNLAF has now also seen that it will be very hard this year, see this link at page 04, sorry only
in Dutch: http://www.defensie.nl/binaries/LR%20DK16_tcm15-72691.pdf 

"Only" four display teams this year, with the Patrouille de France, Royal Jordanian Falcons, Pilatus PC7 team, and one
of my favourites and a great job by the RNLAF to get them here, are the Turkisch Stars. The Thunderbirds where also
almost alligned for these open door days, but they only wanted to perform one week earlier than is planned. At the top
of the list of the "Bureau Air Display" are the display teams "Blue Impuls" and "Team 60", but that can take some years
to get them here. But I'm already happy with the list what they have gathered already, as with every airshow takes it a lot
of effort to get teams here, and just to be honest is a show like last year on of a kind.

Regards, Ramon.
  • Interests: A-10, F-14, F-105, B-58 and warbirds

Offline Webmaster

  • MILAVIA Webmaster
  • Administrator
  • General of Flight
  • *******
  • Posts: 2842
  • Country: nl
Re: RNLAF Open Days 2007 (Volkel AB)
« Reply #3 on: April 26, 2007, 01:20:13 PM »
Ah thanks looks my feelings were right. The event coincides with the Falkland remembrance and Queen Elizabeth's birthday, that's the reason why we're not having the Reds this year. No problem. It looks it means also a 'no' on the Tornado, Hawk, Nimrow, SeaKing, Blue Eagles, and the others we saw. The Merlin Team cancelled their 2007 season completely. But the article tells us a British Chinook will come.... well I guess it's good as our Chinooks are probably tied up in trainng, maintenace and deployment.

Yes, over the years the organizers have tried to pull in more and more teams. And it works, the show brings in more public every year. I'd rather see a fighter solo than some display team flying underpowered trainers.

Blue Impuls? LOL. Put them on your list sure, but why? what do we have to do with Japan? almost nothing. They'll have to go on a European tour to make it interesting, will be a lot of effort to get these trainers to the other side of the world. And why? Japanese air force is still pretty much a self-defense force. Pls, don't bother trying.  ;) You might as well try with the Russian teams then, at least they can get their planes here without too much trouble!

Team 60, will like I said in my last post, our AF just has to show more interest in the SwAF. I feel this relationship has turned cold. Just my observation/feeling.


I suppose, I just have to be happy there are at least these:
- Turkish Stars
- RNLAF F-16 Solo
- RNLAF air power demo
- Belgian F-16 Solo
- Swiss F/A-18 Solo

Hopefully, some more proper jets will turn up, USAF displays? F-15/F-16/A-10. I have to hope for France to see some different types. Otherwise, maybe another Hornet from Spain, and that's it really. Danish/Norwegian/Italian/Portguese/German fighters might be static. Also hoping for CzAF Gripen solo.

And by the way, I think the Germans owe us to bring a P-3C to the show!  ;)

And NH Industries, hello? Bring a NH90, we're buying that, but we haven't seen it yet.

PS: Last year a one-off? I think you might think that because of the Blue Angels. other than that I don't see why future shows can't be of the same quality. Do you need a US display team to have a great show? However, I'd just be happy if 2007 can come close to 2005, never mind 2006. I guess we were spoiled a bit last year. hehe.
  • Interests: Su-15, Su-27, Tu-22, Tornado, RNLAF
Niels Hillebrand
MILAVIA Webmaster

Offline Ramon

  • Scorpion Aviation Photography
  • Global Moderator
  • Fighter Ace
  • *******
  • Posts: 339
  • Country: nl
Re: RNLAF Open Days 2007 (Volkel AB)
« Reply #4 on: April 26, 2007, 02:04:13 PM »
Ah thanks looks my feelings were right. The event coincides with the Falkland remembrance and Queen Elizabeth's birthday, that's the reason why we're not having the Reds this year. No problem. It looks it means also a 'no' on the Tornado, Hawk, Nimrow, SeaKing, Blue Eagles, and the others we saw. The Merlin Team cancelled their 2007 season completely. But the article tells us a British Chinook will come.... well I guess it's good as our Chinooks are probably tied up in trainng, maintenace and deployment.

Yes, over the years the organizers have tried to pull in more and more teams. And it works, the show brings in more public every year. I'd rather see a fighter solo than some display team flying underpowered trainers.

Blue Impuls? LOL. Put them on your list sure, but why? what do we have to do with Japan? almost nothing. They'll have to go on a European tour to make it interesting, will be a lot of effort to get these trainers to the other side of the world. And why? Japanese air force is still pretty much a self-defense force. Pls, don't bother trying.  ;) You might as well try with the Russian teams then, at least they can get their planes here without too much trouble!

Team 60, will like I said in my last post, our AF just has to show more interest in the SwAF. I feel this relationship has turned cold. Just my observation/feeling.


I suppose, I just have to be happy there are at least these:
- Turkish Stars
- RNLAF F-16 Solo
- RNLAF air power demo
- Belgian F-16 Solo
- Swiss F/A-18 Solo

Hopefully, some more proper jets will turn up, USAF displays? F-15/F-16/A-10. I have to hope for France to see some different types. Otherwise, maybe another Hornet from Spain, and that's it really. Danish/Norwegian/Italian/Portguese/German fighters might be static. Also hoping for CzAF Gripen solo.

And by the way, I think the Germans owe us to bring a P-3C to the show!  ;)

And NH Industries, hello? Bring a NH90, we're buying that, but we haven't seen it yet.

PS: Last year a one-off? I think you might think that because of the Blue Angels. other than that I don't see why future shows can't be of the same quality. Do you need a US display team to have a great show? However, I'd just be happy if 2007 can come close to 2005, never mind 2006. I guess we were spoiled a bit last year. hehe.

Hello Niels,

Could not resist to reply on this post  ;)

The RAF has indeed cancelled everything due to the earlier stated Falkland remembrance and Queen Elizabeth's birthday.
Hope that at least the Chinook will come over for a display, always nice to see this one perform.

In my opinion are the "display teams flying underpowered trainers" highly underappreciated by a lot of people that I speak
and read on other Forums. No offence Niels, just my opinion  ::)
Most of the teams are flying wing tip to wing tip with no more space than 3 to 2 meters, and in the meantime perform some
invirted push-overs and dives. Take for example the Red Arrows, they have a test and rehearsel shedule that starts in October
and ends in March. Instead of the Solo aircraft, that can trow his aircraft to all sides of the airfield and starts the rehearsels in
February and is finished in March. Please don't misunderstand this, some solo display display teams are every year a must
see, and are among my highlights, like for example our own RNLAF F-16 Solo Display team, it rocks you everytime of your feet.
On the other hand is the RNLAF PC-7 Solo display not my own highlight of an airshow.

In my opinion are teams like for example Blue Impulse and Team 60 invited as a advertising for these open door days, and to
atract more people to the Open door days, that maybe are going to fly the RNLAF F-16/Chinook/Cougar......etc in the future. And
are not coming over because they can get something out of it, or have good relations with the RNLAF. It is just pure promotion
for the RNLAF. Same like last year with the Blue Angels, just pure promotion for the RNLAF. The Dutch Navy is not one of the
biggest around.....hell, we do not even have a aircraft carrier. So the US Navy Blue Angels where present pure for Dutch promotion.

And for the RNLAF to have more interest in other airforces, you need to have more interfaces with that airforce. The SwAF has not
really anything to share with the RNLAF, training is completely different due to different aircraft types in use. Think that it would make
more sense to have a exercise before or after such a event, that can attract more participants. A very good example are the days at
Kleine Brogel, the Belgium airforce has not or minimum contact with the Greek, Czech Republic, Portugal, Turkey, etc, etc airforce.
But aircrafts that are confirmed for these days are already an F-4E (AUP), L.159, F-16A and F-16C/D's. But it is also a very fine line
that the RNLAF have to walk, these open door days are just for promotion purposes and not really for photographers and spotters.

I think the list that you have made, is indeed the core that we are getting to see at Volkel. Hopefully we see indeed a P-3C Orion from
our German friends  ;D All the other aircrafts from other airforces will only go static, not as interesting to see them flying.

P.S  ;)
Last year was in my opinion a one-off, not only due to the Blue Angels. You do not need to have a US display team to have a great show.
I like almost every display team flying out there, with of course my own personal favourites. But due to the largets amount of solo display
and display teams that they had gathered. There where 9 Display Teams (The RIAT would have been proud with such a list) and 7 official
solo display teams. This is on the record the largest amount of display teams that have participated above Dutch soil, only the 2003
airshow comes close.

Regards, Ramon.  ;D
  • Interests: A-10, F-14, F-105, B-58 and warbirds

Offline Webmaster

  • MILAVIA Webmaster
  • Administrator
  • General of Flight
  • *******
  • Posts: 2842
  • Country: nl
Re: RNLAF Open Days 2007 (Volkel AB)
« Reply #5 on: May 02, 2007, 01:25:21 AM »
Hold on Ramon, other than that statement on what I'd rather see, I was talking from the air force's perspective, not from my enthusiast/photographer view. I don't underpreciate the teams. I think display teams are great, their routines are amazing and all. But I personally prefer to see other jets as well: combat aircraft. Flying such close formations with nice smoke with 6-9 aircraft is hardly what the air force is about.

Of course you use display teams to attract visitors, more visitors means more recruits and more goodwill from the taxpayer. But I just think the organizers may be putting too much emphasis on getting exotic display teams over here. It's all about promotion of course, but it's also about promotion of their country and their air force. That's why they exist in the first place. So I don't believe the US Navy Blue Angels were just here for our promotion of the open days. It's to build relationship with our military and promote the US as an ally to the military and the general public as well. We might not have carriers, but our FAC boys are talking to USN Prowlers and Hornets over Afghanistan for example. Otherwise, they could have better performed that weekend at a show in the USA. This is why I think it's impossible to get blue impulse over, apart from the logistics challenge.

Like I sad in my first post, such an exercise would be great. Even if the participants are just statics at the show. But this takes more than just have a team devoted to fill the airshow schedule with amazing displays. It's a different mindset than let's try to get a team in from the other side of the world, that we can use to attract more people. I wish we had that mindset for the air forces' sake (and we spotters/photographers would be happy as well)

We'll see what this year will bring ;-)
  • Interests: Su-15, Su-27, Tu-22, Tornado, RNLAF
Niels Hillebrand
MILAVIA Webmaster

Offline Ramon

  • Scorpion Aviation Photography
  • Global Moderator
  • Fighter Ace
  • *******
  • Posts: 339
  • Country: nl
Re: RNLAF Open Days 2007 (Volkel AB)
« Reply #6 on: May 15, 2007, 01:06:56 PM »
Hello all,

Looks like they have read some forums, and send out some extra invitations  ::)

Confirmed are now also:

Belgium:
- Seaking (Flying)

France:
Patrouille de France (Flying)
Breitling Jet Team (Flying)  :P

Hungaria:
- AN-26 (Static)
- Saab JAS39 Gripen (Static)

Spain:
EF-18+ Hornet (Flying)

Hope they can keep up coming with some nice updates, but the Spanish Hornet
is already a favourite for me, so I will be there  ;)

Regards, Ramon.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2007, 12:19:42 PM by Scorpion »
  • Interests: A-10, F-14, F-105, B-58 and warbirds

Offline Webmaster

  • MILAVIA Webmaster
  • Administrator
  • General of Flight
  • *******
  • Posts: 2842
  • Country: nl
Re: RNLAF Open Days 2007 (Volkel AB)
« Reply #7 on: May 15, 2007, 04:51:45 PM »
Biele Albatrosy? From France? You mean the Breitling jet team?
Biele Albatrosy is the Slovakian L-39s team, which disbanded in 2004...

Hungary participating, great! Wouldn't mind if they also bring that Hind we saw this weekend  ;D
  • Interests: Su-15, Su-27, Tu-22, Tornado, RNLAF
Niels Hillebrand
MILAVIA Webmaster

Offline Ramon

  • Scorpion Aviation Photography
  • Global Moderator
  • Fighter Ace
  • *******
  • Posts: 339
  • Country: nl
Re: RNLAF Open Days 2007 (Volkel AB)
« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2007, 12:18:35 PM »
Biele Albatrosy? From France? You mean the Breitling jet team?
Biele Albatrosy is the Slovakian L-39s team, which disbanded in 2004...

Hungary participating, great! Wouldn't mind if they also bring that Hind we saw this weekend  ;D

Hello Niels,

My mistake  ::) ..........this happens after a lot of nightshifts  ;)
I mean of course the Breitling Jet team. I'm hoping also on the
Hind, but do not think they will bring it over. The Gripen is good
promotion, and the AN-26 is just here for Gripen support.

And adding to the list now also:
Germany:
- CH-53G (Static)

Great Britain:
- Boeing Chinook HC2 (Flying)

USAF:
- Boeing KC-135/R (Static)

Regards, Ramon.
  • Interests: A-10, F-14, F-105, B-58 and warbirds

Offline Ramon

  • Scorpion Aviation Photography
  • Global Moderator
  • Fighter Ace
  • *******
  • Posts: 339
  • Country: nl
Re: RNLAF Open Days 2007 (Volkel AB)
« Reply #9 on: May 22, 2007, 04:07:23 PM »
Hello guys,

Again a very nice update in the static park  :D

Germany:
- McDonnell Douglas F-4F (ICE) Phantom II
- Panavia Tornado

Turkey:
- Lockheed Martin F-16

France:
- Dassault Rafale
- Dassualt Super Etendard
- Dassault Mirage 2000

Poland:
- Sukhoi Su-22 Fitter

United Kingdom:
- Panavia Tornado GR4

Regards, Ramon.

  • Interests: A-10, F-14, F-105, B-58 and warbirds

Offline Webmaster

  • MILAVIA Webmaster
  • Administrator
  • General of Flight
  • *******
  • Posts: 2842
  • Country: nl
Re: RNLAF Open Days 2007 (Volkel AB)
« Reply #10 on: May 22, 2007, 06:06:05 PM »
Now that makes a good static!  ;D
  • Interests: Su-15, Su-27, Tu-22, Tornado, RNLAF
Niels Hillebrand
MILAVIA Webmaster

Offline Ramon

  • Scorpion Aviation Photography
  • Global Moderator
  • Fighter Ace
  • *******
  • Posts: 339
  • Country: nl
Re: RNLAF Open Days 2007 (Volkel AB)
« Reply #11 on: May 25, 2007, 12:30:56 PM »
Hello all,

And again some great updates, they just do not stop  ;)

Netherlands:
- Agusta Bell AB412 SP (static)
- SE3160S Alouette lll (static)
- Consolidated PBY-5A Catalina (static)
- Hawker Hunter T.7/T.8 (Flying)  ;D

United States:
- Lockheed Martin A-10A (static)
- P-3C Orion (static)

Great job by the Volkel base so far, keep them coming.

Regards, Ramon.
  • Interests: A-10, F-14, F-105, B-58 and warbirds

 



AVIATION TOP 100 - www.avitop.com click to vote for MILAVIA